By Coop

March 5, 2009 6:46 PM | Link to this

I think it’s a huge waste of money to pay for every student to take the PSAT or ACT PLAN. If there’s such a money crunch going on now, I think this would be a good place to reevaluate wasteful spending.

By catlady

March 5, 2009 7:53 PM | Link to this

Both these would be reasonable to CUT, not continue.

By reality 2

March 5, 2009 8:37 PM | Link to this

You know, people may feel these (PSAT or ACT PLAN) are wasteful, but at least these monies are spent directly on students.

I think they should really re-consider the bonus to national board certified teachers. After a few years, they should really show some evidences that they are indeed being effective teachers to continue receiving that money. I don’t even know if they require any student achievement data in the process of obtaining the national board.

By Tony

March 5, 2009 9:42 PM | Link to this

There is plenty of evidence that the nationally board certified teachers do make a difference for students and that they are highly motivated teachers. All this evidence has been minimized by the politicos in an effort to take away the well deserved credit that is due for these teachers.

By Tony

March 5, 2009 9:44 PM | Link to this

Also, the language may be there to allow the teachers to continue to receive the additional pay for their hard work, but the exception in the bill is clear - if the legislature appropriates the funds. Too bad these folks like playing games like this. No wonder we run off good teachers.

By reality 2

March 5, 2009 9:49 PM | Link to this

Tony,

Are these nationally certified teachers really that much more effective than other teachers?

If it is indeed the case, then, this is an example that teacher effectiveness can be somehow evaluated and we can then pay teachers accordingly.

By TeachMe

March 5, 2009 11:32 PM | Link to this

Studies show that national board-certified teachers are more effective than non board-certified teachers. But they have not shown whether the board certification process makes teachers more effective or whether better/more motivated teachers are just attracted to the process of being board certified.

By teacher teacher

March 6, 2009 11:43 AM | Link to this

Reality 2 -

Really? You are second guessing a rigorous, financial committment SOME teachers make to gain the status of a National Board Certified Teacher?

I’m sorry, guys, but you don’t get to be Nationally Board Certified teacher by driving past an office with your window down and have someone throw a certificate at you.

Now, that might be the case for some of the diploma mill/education schools out there, but that’s a different argument.

Reality2 is the kind of person that plays armchair quarterback when they probably haven’t even stepped into a classroom, let alone TAUGHT a class, but feels they can somehow do it better than any teacher. Kind of like our current legislative body at the Capitol.

By realit 2

March 6, 2009 2:03 PM | Link to this

teacher teacher,

It’s just amazing that some people can tell what other people do and think from short blog posts.

Anyway, maybe you can tell me exactly what is involved in the application process? Do teachers have to submit their students’ achievement data? Do they have to provide evidences that their instruction is THE, or at least a major part of the, reason for students’ gain?

The National Board is better than the Presidential Awards because they at least require the applicants to submit videos from their classrooms. But, NB is still about “qualification,” not “effectiveness,” isn’t it?

By Reality

March 6, 2009 2:28 PM | Link to this

It doesn’t make sense to me that some teachers are being fired (and as a result, class sizes are increasing) while other teachers get a bonus.

How does this make sense to anyone, especially considering that education is supposed to be for the students.

By reality 2

March 6, 2009 2:44 PM | Link to this

It really doesn’t make any sense to me that some teachers are much more effective than others but getting paid the same salaries as others who are not anywhere near as effective. How does this make sense to anyone, especially considering that education is supposed to be for the students. If teachers aren’t helping students learn effectively, why should they be paid the same as those who ARE making differences?

By teacher teacher

March 6, 2009 3:26 PM | Link to this

Reality 2 -

Check out the website: http://www.nbpts.org/

You are exactly right: education is supposed to be for the students. But keep in mind there are some teachers (very good teachers) struggling every day in the classroom trying to find ways to reach students that have no interest in being in school. At what point do you suggest that the student and their family are responsible for the student’s achievement?

I can’t believe you or anyone would shame a teacher for trying to better themselves professionally in order to help students achieve. Considering the hefty financial application fee comes directly out of a teacher’s pocket, you’d better believe that only a serious improvement-minded teacher seeking professional advancement would apply.

Your analogy is kind of like wondering if a doctor who went through their intern years but decided not to do a residency is an effective doctor.

Clearly, you have not darkened the doorstep of any classroom lately - if ever.

By ScienceTeacher671

March 6, 2009 5:54 PM | Link to this

Reality 2, how do you determine which teachers are effective and which are not? What criteria would you use?

By Tony

March 6, 2009 6:59 PM | Link to this

There is currently a propaganda campaign from the governor’s office to minimize the research results that show the effectiveness of the nationally certified teachers. If you plow through the research that they cite, you’ll find in the very first pages the researchers found a very strong and positive effect of the national board certified teachers. Further, they found that national certification was a useful tool in evaluating differential pay scales. Why? Because the nationally certified teachers were the ones willing to put in the extra work it takes to be an excellent teacher. The governor’s staff has tried to minimize the research results by focusing on a couple of statistics, mainly effect sizes on a couple of carefully selected aspects of the study. Lies, damn lies and statistics.

By Reality 2

March 6, 2009 9:59 PM | Link to this

Sci Tchr

Well, it looks like Tony answered your question - at least NB apparently identifies the effective ones. Let’s give them the bonuses and keep all others at their regular level - maybe we should cut their pays so that we can afford the bonuses.

By Dr. Craig Spinks/Evans

March 7, 2009 4:10 AM | Link to this

Our state’s NBTC-based salary differentials, unlike the others based upon degree- and experience-levels, focus our attention upon what a teacher has done in his/her classroom as many as ten years ago. Might I suggest we refocus upon what the teacher’s students did no-longer-ago than last year.

By dondon

March 8, 2009 7:51 AM | Link to this

Why not more money for special education teacher. They is a serious shortage of them.

By dondon

March 8, 2009 7:54 AM | Link to this

why not bonus for sped teachers? Not many of them.

By ScienceTeacher671

March 8, 2009 8:16 AM | Link to this

I don’t doubt that national board certified teachers are effective, but are they the only ones?

Or should those of us who wish to be thought effective go through the process to prove it?

By Tony

March 8, 2009 1:36 PM | Link to this

The thing that concerns me the most in this debate in our legislature is that a promise was made to the teachers who earned the national certification. Now the politics du jour wants to break that promise in favor of making a new promise. How are we supposed to believe that any promise made will be kept?

Regarding using test scores as a means of determining effectiveness such as the governor would like to do, that promise has already been broken as well. When the Georgia Legislature passed the A+ Education Reform Act, it included a means to pay teachers up to $2,000 per year extra for meeting certain achievement standards on the statewide testing program. However, just as this plan was about to become active, it was pulled. Schools were showing improvement and meeting the requirements to earn the bonuses, but the governor and legislature pulled the plug. Why should we believe them when they promise us with a new way to earn bonuses?

There are many worthy teachers deserving of bonuses for the work they do in teaching children. In every subject area and program area, you will find outstanding teachers who make a difference in the student achievement. If the politicians would stop trying to micromanage schools, perhaps we could reward these deserving people.

By reality 2

March 8, 2009 10:46 PM | Link to this

If and when we do start rewarding effective teachers, we need administrators and teachers leaders with a backbone to stand against mediocre/average teachers and tell them why they should NOT be receiving any reward. Too often in education, we avoid rewarding the excellence and recognize everyone.